39 replies to this topic

[Yanni]

Last I checked this is fishing, and as you said this is a fishing forum. As well as just as many people have shown interest/support as there have been people going on irrational rants.

If someone does not like a certain method, they don't have to participate, nor is anyone forcing them to view this. They can create a thread discussing their dislike for it, or a thread to have a discussion about it. They can also voice themselves publicly against it. There is a time and place for everything.

The only people who have been trying to troll, derail, hijack, and stir the pot have been anti's; again a new thread should be created if someone wants to discuss another topic instead of derailing a thread. This is "ontariofishingforums.com", just because a small group of people choose to use this forum and possess a negative view on something doesn't lower the legitimacy of an fishing method. There is no logic in that, so if this forum was full of bow fishers they should be telling non-bowfishers/people who don't share their view to go elsewhere?

There is also a huge difference in expressing dis-contempt with acting immature.

[JimCanuck]

As ANYONE can SEE, this is a FISHING SITE - Not a HUNTING FORUM!

Fishing the definition of, per Websters:

the sport or business of catching fish

No where does it say only angling can be discussed, which the definition of is,

the action of one who angles; especially : the action or sport of fishing with hook and line

And agan the MNR disagreess with you, you know the "Supreme law of the land" when it comes to Fishing and Hunting in Ontario, lists Bow FISHING, is a FISHING method, legal in the province of Ontario. If it was a "Hunting" method it would be in the Hunting regulations summery and would require a hunting license, which it does not.

There is CATCH, but absolutely 0% percentage of RELEASE with using a BOW.

The current trend very much promotes a greater effort for CATCH & RELEASE.

Well Blair, what does your fishing license say "Catch and Release" or does it say "Sport fishing" ? Because again except in areas with depleted fish stocks, the Sport Fishing license entities one to keep everything they catch up until their maximum creel limit. And yet again the MNR disagrees with your opinions, as it deems there is no need to place any such a limitations on the Carp population.

Boy do some people need to learn the language they are speaking before they open their mouth, cause apparently an understanding of English is not required to complete the education system here.

I'm sorry Blair, why don't you get a little more educated in English, followed by a reading comprehension course or two, so next time you open the Ontario FISHING regulations maybe you'll be able to understand them?

Jim

[JimCanuck]

*Touche (French) on showing your a Hypocrite ( Greek)

I don't know if you understand the irony of that statement. Firstly because both of those languages are my primary languages in life, as I said in the shout box English is my third language.

Hypocrisy is not only preaching one thing and doing another, as is commonly believed by most English speakers today, instead it is something deeper then that, its the deception of others while hiding your own actions. A drug addict who tells other drug addicts that drugs are bad and you shouldn't take them is not a hypocrite unless he conceals the fact he is a drug addict to them.

Regretfully I can not be a hypocrite with regards to "insults" as you are attempting to make me out to be, for one, I did not denounce his insults, I simply stated in a question that the anti-bow fishing thinking has officially progressed to insults and I wanted to be clear that was the case. I have never said that insults were not a valid means of discussion, but its nice to know when the discussion progresses to it, as tactics in conversation sometimes may need adjustment for it.

Secondly, I did not insult you nor was I rude, at least in the sense that it may constitute a insulting tone. It was a simple cause and effect logic between you not understanding what "fishing", "angling" and "hunting" is, and a lack of education typically being the cause.

In addition to this, if you want real hypocrisy, you claim to be all about catch and release, and yet the majority of pictures in your photobucket stream clearly show that most of the fish that you have caught, did not make it back into the water, and the ones that did clearly didn't live long afterwards as you completely disregarded standard handling methods for catch and release that will maximize the possibility of the fish making a recovery. So by posting that its all about "catch and release", denouncing another Fisherman for fishing with full honesty that he intends to keep his catch and yet not mentioning your typical methods as evident in your pictures, you are the one being a hypocrite. Congratulations!

Jim

[NADO]

Wowzers! I thought this thread might manage to bee a peaceful once since we took all of the bow fishing pics or were forced to take the pics out of the Goldfish thread and put them over here. A small select group of carp enthusiasts seem to think they can force the bow fishers off of this forum??

Blair im surprised you regressed and jumped on the anti-bow fishing side. When Yanni posted the picture he was a new member and had no idea of the chain reaction his post was about to cause, he certainly wasn’t stirring the pot. I have been researching that method of angling for the past few months so I personally appreciated his post, there is only maybe 4 or 5 people here who actually get offended by that post so I don’t see why we should be forcing him away when all he was trying to do was contribute to the forum.

There is clearly a reason the MNR has made bow fishing for carp a legal method of angling. Carp enthusiasts can cover their ears and yell LALALALALALALA all they want but the facts will not disappear.

[ChaseChrome]

BOY!!!


Chase is sure sorry he's missed an opportunity here!!!

[ChaseChrome]

I don't know if you understand the irony of that statement. Firstly because both of those languages are my primary languages in life, as I said in the shout box English is my third language.

Hypocrisy is not only preaching one thing and doing another, as is commonly believed by most English speakers today, instead it is something deeper then that, its the deception of others while hiding your own actions. A drug addict who tells other drug addicts that drugs are bad and you shouldn't take them is not a hypocrite unless he conceals the fact he is a drug addict to them.

Regretfully I can not be a hypocrite with regards to "insults" as you are attempting to make me out to be, for one, I did not denounce his insults, I simply stated in a question that the anti-bow fishing thinking has officially progressed to insults and I wanted to be clear that was the case. I have never said that insults were not a valid means of discussion, but its nice to know when the discussion progresses to it, as tactics in conversation sometimes may need adjustment for it.

Secondly, I did not insult you nor was I rude, at least in the sense that it may constitute a insulting tone. It was a simple cause and effect logic between you not understanding what "fishing", "angling" and "hunting" is, and a lack of education typically being the cause.

In addition to this, if you want real hypocrisy, you claim to be all about catch and release, and yet the majority of pictures in your photobucket stream clearly show that most of the fish that you have caught, did not make it back into the water, and the ones that did clearly didn't live long afterwards as you completely disregarded standard handling methods for catch and release that will maximize the possibility of the fish making a recovery. So by posting that its all about "catch and release", denouncing another Fisherman for fishing with full honesty that he intends to keep his catch and yet not mentioning your typical methods as evident in your pictures, you are the one being a hypocrite. Congratulations!

Jim

It has been my experience that the people here are generally, well informed about angling, are rather generous (unlike other sites), are fair minded, and don't really care for the high anxiety reparte that is the general state of other fora.

So just take it easy....
CC

[troutddicted]

BOY!!!


Chase is sure sorry he's missed an opportunity here!!!

Welcome back

[FishingNoob]

I personally do not mind people bow fishing for carp or for that matter any other fish that it is legal to do so. I practice catch and release with few exceptions (I love pickerel and Blue Gill). I've seen people that fish with rod and line never get a fish with a bow and visa versa, each requires different skills and different attitudes to "fishing". If I wanted to try something different, and was feeling for some in season fish, I would go bow fishing. If I wanted to release all the fish with minimal damage, or was fishing with others that would be bored not always having something to do I would use rod and line. Just my two cents, probably not to accurate as I am a beginner to everything fish. Cheers.

[JimCanuck]

That's impressive Jim!!!

Whats impressive?

Jim

[tangledline]

the trash talk is why i do not post often on this site any more.

yes bowfishing is legal but that doesn't always sit well with some people who are passionate about a species of fish and its well being.
i like to think that if the end of the world as it is came to be.....i could bowfish to improve my survival...easier to catch the fish...i plan on eating them all.
but from the bowfishing videos i have seen the fish stand little chance of escape and it is a onesided affair....and there is no opportunity for catch and release.
i love carp as much as i love gar....and both take an awful population loss from this fishing technique south of the border where it is very popular.
in the late 1800's up to the 1950's gar and pike,muskie and bowfin were killed on their sighting....if you caught one you killed it....lots of reports of netting and shooting with guns etc.
the practice of killing these top predators was so popular that it decimated their populations and changed the ecosystem....
later on in history we found we like muskie and pike and they were sports fish now not trash fish....
changes in perception, understanding, appreciation for the species and its value both as a sportfish and its role in the ecosystem changed fishing practices.
Blair is light years ahead of most as a steward and ambassador to our sport of fishing....he is so very passionate about this subject that i know and understand that he is frustrated with views and current legal fishing practices......all said...i think he is trying passionately to sway your views towards the vision he and many others like myself have for the sport but
those who bowfish do have their right under current laws to fish using this technique and should be able to share their techniques and photos and reports on a fishing forum such as this...because its a hot potatoe subject i understand and would prefer it have its own forum section.
you guys are arguing multiple views and ethics of a sport at a crossover period in its evolution....no one's opinion are wrong at this point so much as everyone is wrong when they cross the forum policies of being gentlemen and polite with each other....please respect each other's entitlement to an opinion...especially when you do not agree with it.
all this arguing sickens me...when do you guys have time to fish?...where were you when your sport needed your help during fishing prohibition?
you guys were here arguing....lol ...anglers are suppose to be a peaceful bunch....you could all be better ambassadors to the sport...if i was a 15 year old following the threads of this forum what impression would i get?
sorry for my grammer and english i was born here and educated here and i ain't so smart.

[tangledline]

I went to SAIL today for the grand opening to check out the carp gear.So I was wearing my CAG t-shirt and two of Canada's fishing celebrities (Angalo Viola and Pete Bowman) of the Fish'n Canada Show called me over to talk about carp fishing.They just finnished filming an episode in the Hamilton Harbour and the Toronto Islands where they were fishing for carp and one guy with them caught a 40lber in Toronto.For my American friends,these guys are big fishermen up here and they travel across Canada catching giant sturgeon in British Columbia,Char above the arctic circle,huge pike in Sasatchewan,big bass,walleye and musky in Ontario and stripe bass and blue sharks in Nova Scotia.They've done carp shows before but this time they brought they're camera's to Hamilton.We talked for an hour and other pro bass anglers joined in on the conversation and all had a great carp story and they all agreed carp fishing is growing in Canada.They said it is the next great sport fish.That means alot coming from pro fishermen of they're caliber.It's nice to be recognized as a sport fish but on the other hand more people fishing for carp could make bank space hard to find.
posted on CAG forum carpanglersgroup.com by 2carp

40lb carp caught at Toronto Islands...a city park......prohibited fishing in Toronto parks and you hurt the business of sport fishing....
the giant Sail store just had its grand openning.....fishing is big business in the GTA....if it wasn't why would these superstores be openning around the GTA. the city councillors need to see the value to the economy that fishing brings this city...

on another point
the 40lb carp was caught shorefishing and would not have been caught if access to the water from the shores of a city park were prohibitted.
Toronto could market its great carp fishing to the world if only it understood its business success in other parts of the world.
hopefully the film footage will go viral on the internet when the show is televised.

[JimCanuck]

the city councillors need to see the value to the economy that fishing brings this city...

Considering on June 12th, not only did City council approved Paula Fletcher's motion of "Gone Fishing" pass BUT the motion removing the "No Fishing" signs that were posed passed unanimously.

And just for anyone who doesn't understand English, unanimous means:

formed with or indicating unanimity : having the agreement and consent of all

Seems to me, the City Councillors, even if they did not support fishing entirely, did see the value of allowing fishing to continue in Toronto.

So I really don't get your post?

By the way the email Paula sent to everyone who sent emails out about the fishing signs and her "Gone Fishing" motion.

https://docs.google....th6qSSQLMwH_I9a

Jim

[FishingNoob]

Whats impressive?

Jim

Seems like Yanni is a good fisherman , so when you said I taught him I was impressed. Don't really know if that cleared it up.

[FishingNoob]

the trash talk is why i do not post often on this site any more.

yes bowfishing is legal but that doesn't always sit well with some people who are passionate about a species of fish and its well being.
i like to think that if the end of the world as it is came to be.....i could bowfish to improve my survival...easier to catch the fish...i plan on eating them all.
but from the bowfishing videos i have seen the fish stand little chance of escape and it is a onesided affair....and there is no opportunity for catch and release.
i love carp as much as i love gar....and both take an awful population loss from this fishing technique south of the border where it is very popular.
in the late 1800's up to the 1950's gar and pike,muskie and bowfin were killed on their sighting....if you caught one you killed it....lots of reports of netting and shooting with guns etc.
the practice of killing these top predators was so popular that it decimated their populations and changed the ecosystem....
later on in history we found we like muskie and pike and they were sports fish now not trash fish....
changes in perception, understanding, appreciation for the species and its value both as a sportfish and its role in the ecosystem changed fishing practices.
Blair is light years ahead of most as a steward and ambassador to our sport of fishing....he is so very passionate about this subject that i know and understand that he is frustrated with views and current legal fishing practices......all said...i think he is trying passionately to sway your views towards the vision he and many others like myself have for the sport but
those who bowfish do have their right under current laws to fish using this technique and should be able to share their techniques and photos and reports on a fishing forum such as this...because its a hot potatoe subject i understand and would prefer it have its own forum section.
you guys are arguing multiple views and ethics of a sport at a crossover period in its evolution....no one's opinion are wrong at this point so much as everyone is wrong when they cross the forum policies of being gentlemen and polite with each other....please respect each other's entitlement to an opinion...especially when you do not agree with it.
all this arguing sickens me...when do you guys have time to fish?...where were you when your sport needed your help during fishing prohibition?
you guys were here arguing....lol ...anglers are suppose to be a peaceful bunch....you could all be better ambassadors to the sport...if i was a 15 year old following the threads of this forum what impression would i get?
sorry for my grammer and english i was born here and educated here and i ain't so smart.

I concur with everything you said! You are very well spoken I think tangled. After I saw River Monsters episode on the Alligator Gar, I have been abscessed with Gar.

[FishingNoob]

I went to SAIL today for the grand opening to check out the carp gear.So I was wearing my CAG t-shirt and two of Canada's fishing celebrities (Angalo Viola and Pete Bowman) of the Fish'n Canada Show called me over to talk about carp fishing.They just finnished filming an episode in the Hamilton Harbour and the Toronto Islands where they were fishing for carp and one guy with them caught a 40lber in Toronto.For my American friends,these guys are big fishermen up here and they travel across Canada catching giant sturgeon in British Columbia,Char above the arctic circle,huge pike in Sasatchewan,big bass,walleye and musky in Ontario and stripe bass and blue sharks in Nova Scotia.They've done carp shows before but this time they brought they're camera's to Hamilton.We talked for an hour and other pro bass anglers joined in on the conversation and all had a great carp story and they all agreed carp fishing is growing in Canada.They said it is the next great sport fish.That means alot coming from pro fishermen of they're caliber.It's nice to be recognized as a sport fish but on the other hand more people fishing for carp could make bank space hard to find.
posted on CAG forum carpanglersgroup.com by 2carp

40lb carp caught at Toronto Islands...a city park......prohibited fishing in Toronto parks and you hurt the business of sport fishing....
the giant Sail store just had its grand openning.....fishing is big business in the GTA....if it wasn't why would these superstores be openning around the GTA. the city councillors need to see the value to the economy that fishing brings this city...

on another point
the 40lb carp was caught shorefishing and would not have been caught if access to the water from the shores of a city park were prohibitted.
Toronto could market its great carp fishing to the world if only it understood its business success in other parts of the world.
hopefully the film footage will go viral on the internet when the show is televised.

I watch them (Angalo Viola and Pete Bowman) every week!! Did you talk about anything else?? Cheers.

[tangledline]

Considering on June 12th, not only did City council approved Paula Fletcher's motion of "Gone Fishing" pass BUT the motion removing the "No Fishing" signs that were posed passed unanimously.

And just for anyone who doesn't understand English, unanimous means:



Seems to me, the City Councillors, even if they did not support fishing entirely, did see the value of allowing fishing to continue in Toronto.

So I really don't get your post?

By the way the email Paula sent to everyone who sent emails out about the fishing signs and her "Gone Fishing" motion.

https://docs.google....th6qSSQLMwH_I9a

Jim



the vote was the evecutive committee not the entire council....the council will be voting july11....the signs came down because they went up with no democratic process....they came down because i had a gentleman who is very wealthy and influential with the city threaten to sue the city of toronto if they could not prove the signs were posted after democratic process...also the provincial and federal governments asked the same thing of the city who were caught with their pants down cause the decision to put up the signs was a back door deal between two city employees....the democratic process actually begins july11....that is why i ask people to voice their concerns now.

[gabe]

I don't know if you understand the irony of that statement. Firstly because both of those languages are my primary languages in life, as I said in the shout box English is my third language.

Hypocrisy is not only preaching one thing and doing another, as is commonly believed by most English speakers today, instead it is something deeper then that, its the deception of others while hiding your own actions. A drug addict who tells other drug addicts that drugs are bad and you shouldn't take them is not a hypocrite unless he conceals the fact he is a drug addict to them.

Regretfully I can not be a hypocrite with regards to "insults" as you are attempting to make me out to be, for one, I did not denounce his insults, I simply stated in a question that the anti-bow fishing thinking has officially progressed to insults and I wanted to be clear that was the case. I have never said that insults were not a valid means of discussion, but its nice to know when the discussion progresses to it, as tactics in conversation sometimes may need adjustment for it.

Secondly, I did not insult you nor was I rude, at least in the sense that it may constitute a insulting tone. It was a simple cause and effect logic between you not understanding what "fishing", "angling" and "hunting" is, and a lack of education typically being the cause.

In addition to this, if you want real hypocrisy, you claim to be all about catch and release, and yet the majority of pictures in your photobucket stream clearly show that most of the fish that you have caught, did not make it back into the water, and the ones that did clearly didn't live long afterwards as you completely disregarded standard handling methods for catch and release that will maximize the possibility of the fish making a recovery. So by posting that its all about "catch and release", denouncing another Fisherman for fishing with full honesty that he intends to keep his catch and yet not mentioning your typical methods as evident in your pictures, you are the one being a hypocrite. Congratulations!

Jim

Well said Jim.I couldn't have it in any better way.

[gabe]

More emotional drivel lacking any sort of logic. I've been fishing for plenty of different fish for over 20 years, and to say that it takes more skill is very ignorant(not saying one or the other takes more, they both have their differences in difficulty). Most fishing is simply having a proper setup (depending on method being used and fish targeted) and waiting for a bite. Then with a bow it's again waiting for a fish, however needing accuracy to aim without a sight and to compete against the refraction.

Plenty of assumptions being made, as well as insults. Evidently some people can't have a rational discussion due to getting caught up in their emotions and enjoy ignoring facts. As for fishing a certain way making someone pathetic, anyone can toss out their personal bias.. there are plenty of people who will say releasing or keeping a certain fish is wrong, fishing in general is wrong, hunting is wrong, etc etc etc. You may want to consider seeking help if something bothers you this much.

Agreed... some individuals just feels more confident by putting others down because they lack confidence in themselves. Its the sad reality

[woolyworm]

Hold on there, Blair, are you saying that no one should post pictures of a dead fish? If fish are taken legally, and are killed for consumption, I don't see what the problem is.

Catch and release kills fish too. Even the best catch and release methods will result in some percent of fish caught dieing. If one cares so much for the lives of the fish, they probably shouldn't be fishing.

Bowfishing is a legitamate, legal way of fishing, not hunting. For bowfishing, you need a fishing license, just as you do for other non-angling methods of fishing, such as dip-netting for smelt.

I find it hard to understand why people are so quick to get up on their high horse and look down on others...