41 replies to this topic

[Rainbow]

I think a 1 fish limit would be a huge improvement. I sometimes see the same guys keeping 2 every time they go out like it's their main source of food

[ChaseChrome]

I think a 1 fish limit would be a huge improvement. I sometimes see the same guys keeping 2 every time they go out like it's their main source of food

 

Well I know that the locals in the Soo will return day after day to "limit out" (matters not whether 6, 2, or 1 really) on a river whose run (last I heard) was about 5000 fish...of the number taken I would guess a percentage of them are hens...do the math...how many generations lost to a truly wild population of trout????

[CanadianAngler87]

i agree with you there chase shuld be c and r only for at least all trout species

Im all for C and R for steelies on major lake tribs. But what about the trout the government has stocked in lakes for Put and Take purposes. Splake are widly stocked through many of our lakes and they don't naturaly reproduce. C and R yes, but not on all trout species..

[Alfiegee]

Well I know that the locals in the Soo will return day after day to "limit out" (matters not whether 6, 2, or 1 really) on a river whose run (last I heard) was about 5000 fish...of the number taken I would guess a percentage of them are hens...do the math...how many generations lost to a truly wild population of trout????

I do not disagree CC, but a lot of people in the Soo are native and have native rights. I spend a lot of time there and know many natives.

 

Alfie.

[ChaseChrome]

I do not disagree CC, but a lot of people in the Soo are native and have native rights. I spend a lot of time there and know many natives.

 

Alfie.

 No, I'm talking about the non-first nations local town folk who fish the St. Mary's bro...as far as native rights are concerned....(too many have been legislated away unfortunately)...

[FrequentFlyer]

a yearly limit would be impossible to enforce, daily limits much easier and cost effective, just need to be hiring more CO's, not firing them

 

 

as for natives, thats a whole other topic on its own, im all for native rights, but there needs to be a limit set there too, i mean whats the difference between a native taking 10 trout just because, and a non native taking 10 fish? there needs to be a more consistent effort put towards conservation, and not segregating one group from another, we all breathe the same air, drink the same water, eat the same food, and fish/hunt the same land

[Alfiegee]

A yearly limit in the east is enforced the same way, Moose or Deer hunting is enforced here. You get one tag each year, or whatever and your tag is attached to your catch. Your catch would have to be reported. Anyone with a fish without the tag attached would be nailed. This is not perfect and does still allow for cheaters. It also doesn't take into account the number of COs and the huge area they have to cover. Selling tags may even allow the hiring of a few additional COs. I won't get into the "slush fund."

 

a yearly limit would be impossible to enforce, daily limits much easier and cost effective, just need to be hiring more CO's, not firing them

 

 

as for natives, thats a whole other topic on its own, im all for native rights, but there needs to be a limit set there too, i mean whats the difference between a native taking 10 trout just because, and a non native taking 10 fish? there needs to be a more consistent effort put towards conservation, and not segregating one group from another, we all breathe the same air, drink the same water, eat the same food, and fish/hunt the same land

As for the native issue, we all bleed red too. The government of Canada entered into agreements with the First Nations and as such have to honor those agreements. There are of course a few bad apples, but most natives to not abuse the fisheries, they also want the fish to be there for years to come. Their families are not going to disappear, why would they want an important food source to disappear? Be it Fish, Moose, Deer or Black Bear? I am aware that some do abuse fisheries in the southern Georgian Bay region knowing clubs and the MNR will keep stocking more Fish. In the Soo area where my friends are it is a way of life and they rely on it in some part for sustinance. They don't take more fish than they need nor do they ask me for mine that I am releasing.

 

Alfie.

[iJay]

Really the best way to enforce this, instead of purchasing licences, purchase tags.

If you are sport fisher you need no tags, but to contribute you would need a conservation licences (as we have now), but take a class or something on handling fish properly for catch and release. I see so many yahoo's place steelheads or salmon back and the fish turns sideways, the current takes them away and the fish dies.

 

The tags would be purchased based on season and species color coded and tag #'s on them. every fish you ake out of the river/lake would need to have a tag on it in order to take them. There will still be poachers who will tke those risks, but for MNR its so simple "sir/madam open your cooler please, no tag, love em send em to jail"

 

Over fishing is a problem and poaching is a crime.

[Alfiegee]

Really the best way to enforce this, instead of purchasing licences, purchase tags.

If you are sport fisher you need no tags, but to contribute you would need a conservation licences (as we have now), but take a class or something on handling fish properly for catch and release. I see so many yahoo's place steelheads or salmon back and the fish turns sideways, the current takes them away and the fish dies.

 

The tags would be purchased based on season and species color coded and tag #'s on them. every fish you ake out of the river/lake would need to have a tag on it in order to take them. There will still be poachers who will tke those risks, but for MNR its so simple "sir/madam open your cooler please, no tag, love em send em to jail"

 

Over fishing is a problem and poaching is a crime.

Don't we all wish that, fisheries abusers, "loogans." Would be sent to jail and not slapped on the wrist and told they were naughty.

I heard you iJay and as I said tags may be the way to go.

 

Im all for C and R for steelies on major lake tribs. But what about the trout the government has stocked in lakes for Put and Take purposes. Splake are widly stocked through many of our lakes and they don't naturaly reproduce. C and R yes, but not on all trout species..

As I have stated may times before, I am mainly P and R (photo and release) when it comes to fishing. I would say over 95 % of fish I catch are released. That being said, I don't care what anyone says, Trout are a much better tasting fish than Walleye and if I catch one that is bleeding then I will keep it rather than let it float away to die and become turtle food.

 

Alfie.

[FrequentFlyer]

A yearly limit in the east is enforced the same way, Moose or Deer hunting is enforced here. You get one tag each year, or whatever and your tag is attached to your catch. Your catch would have to be reported. Anyone with a fish without the tag attached would be nailed. This is not perfect and does still allow for cheaters. It also doesn't take into account the number of COs and the huge area they have to cover. Selling tags may even allow the hiring of a few additional COs. I won't get into the "slush fund."

 

As for the native issue, we all bleed red too. The government of Canada entered into agreements with the First Nations and as such have to honor those agreements. There are of course a few bad apples, but most natives to not abuse the fisheries, they also want the fish to be there for years to come. Their families are not going to disappear, why would they want an important food source to disappear? Be it Fish, Moose, Deer or Black Bear? I am aware that some do abuse fisheries in the southern Georgian Bay region knowing clubs and the MNR will keep stocking more Fish. In the Soo area where my friends are it is a way of life and they rely on it in some part for sustinance. They don't take more fish than they need nor do they ask me for mine that I am releasing.

 

Alfie.

 

 

the natives that live in the north, i agree, its a way of life, its their survival, but say draw a line from toronto to owen sound, anything south of that, its not really a way of life issue any more.  the resources are there to easily get a good education, and some do, i know some really brilliant natives, sadly others would rather sit back on their status cards and let the government pay for everything.

[Mr. Bassturd]

hey we have to write a test to get a license to drive our cars and to get your fishing license is very easy maybe a little to easy? as a matter of fact I recall not even being asked for ID the last time I got my outdoors card. Now am I saying that we should overcomplicate the process nooo not by any means but there should be more education geared towards first time card holders and newcomers to the sport therefore ignorance can no longer be an excuse.  And if there is more education given about Canadian fish species and there history here then maybe more people will understand C&R and realize that certain species such as trout and salmon atleast in Ontario while lots of fun to catch you don't need to limit out every time your out

[riverhugger]

Should just be C&R for most of south/southwest/GTA. 

 

In a highly populated area like this I find it hard to believe that people NEED to fish to eat. You can go to the store and get 4 large chicken breast on sale for 5$, you can't replace lost fisheries.

[DitchWizard]

Should just be C&R for most of south/southwest/GTA. 

 

In a highly populated area like this I find it hard to believe that people NEED to fish to eat. You can go to the store and get 4 large chicken breast on sale for 5$, you can't replace lost fisheries.

I don't think anyone fishing is so poor that it will be their only food for that day. Some people just think they need to keep the fish they catch...don't ask me why.

[riverhugger]

I don't think anyone fishing is so poor that it will be their only food for that day. Some people just think they need to keep the fish they catch...don't ask me why.

Only real option is C&R only zones, like stretches of grand.

[NiagaraSteel]

Be nice if they acctualy used ALL the money we spend on licence instead of putting it in a big slush fund..

Slushies for everyone

[Icehut]

It's an impossible issue. Anglers, like all voters, will basically never agree to the limitations that would actually protect the thing they love. Love to eat fish? Buy it from the store, FFS, stop raping the resource.

 

Worried about where your license dollars go? Don't, our input is a drop in the bucket. We fund a very tiny percentage of what the fisheries actually cost. Think about it a bit.

 

So, to achieve fishermen (and women!) nirvana, here's what we do.

 

First, we eliminate all stocking, except to bring native species back to where they were, if it is feasible. (If you live for put and take fishing, and feel ripped off when you fail to limit out, I'm sorry, this is the wrong hobby for you. The concrete-lined trout farm is over there, bring orange mini-marshmallows, sport, or better yet, take up golf. There is more to this than simply entertaining you.) All the money saved on hatcheries and designing frankenfish will go directly into enforcement.

 

Then we eliminate the idea that somebody can own water. This is OUR WATER. You don't get to own a lake. You don't get to own a river shore. It all belongs to Canadians. We have the right to fish ALL OF OUR WATER. I don't have to drive by acres of private fish-filled gravel pits to get to my bass river, and deal with screaming rich scum that own the banks of my favorite trout stream. The pressure is spread out, the wealthy are brought down a peg, and the gov't can save money as they don't have to run those silly get-fit advertisements begging us to stop getting so fat.

 

Then, eliminate seasons, in favor of imposing 365 catch and release, barbless, no bait rules on many waterbodies, especially all trout streams.

 

In fact, go barbless province wide and ELIMINATE THE USE OF ROE right now. Good anglers do not need roe, it leads to mindless slaughter of salmon by steelheaders.

 

Massively reduce all limits, putting a limit of zero whenever it's needed, especially on the fragile or top quality sportfish like brookies, sturgeon, steelhead, atlantics.

 

Native gillnetting and immunity to the law? Oh, I don't think so, THOSE DAYS ARE EFFING OVER! Either you are a CITIZEN OF CANADA or you are not. Comply with our laws, or move along, please, you're not welcome. Treaty rights from last century... oh, boo hoo... If we can happily subsidize horse tracks for $300 million a year, we can throw the natives enough money to close every reserve and turn them into citizens. Tough decision... a fist full of cash or "native heritage" and "living the way of the elders"... take the money or begone. Boom, right there we've eliminated a major burr under the saddle of the majority of anglers. Nobody likes a TINY MINORITY getting special rights, it is utter horseshit and must be stopped.

 

And then, realizing that laws without enforcement are idiotic and pointless, I'd suggest raising taxes and at least doubling the cost of a license so that THE RESOURCE IS ACTUALLY PROTECTED. If we can afford to have thousands of cops sitting around looking for somebody doing 15 km over the speed limit, we can afford to take our natural heritage seriously. I WANT to see conservation officers every now and then instead of once per decade. Have enough money so that biology, instead of opinion, makes the law.

 

Educate, enforce, and punish. Maybe if you cannot differentiate between a chinook salmon and a brown trout, or pike vs musky... YOU DON'T GET A LICENSE. Maybe if you cannot recite the basic laws... you don't get to fish. Can't be bothered to crimp a barb? Such a lazy angler that you have to use roe? That'll be a hundred bucks and we'll take your gear, too, thank you very much. Double the possession limit... oh my, nice car, we'll take it, and here's a five grand fine. And enforce all the American anglers coming across the borders too, none of them cross back without an inspection. Private lakes up north especially. This will pay for itself in a short time.

 

And having said that, cut the rule book down by about 9/10'ths and make it simple enough that a child can memorize it. It is currently INSANE... closed season here for this fish, until we change it, and special extension there and slot limits over here (btw 16 and 21" is legal on Friday but Wednesday you can have 3 over 22" unless it's a leap year, WTF???)  and you can't fish across this line, and we protect this species while it's spawning but not this one...  it's absurd, you don't need laws for every separate river, you need common sense blanket rules... like 365 day seasons for catch and release anglers. Eliminate this horseshit outdoors card, too, I just want to have one fishing license, pretty please, and I'd like to buy it once a decade and it should be available everywhere they sell tackle, no fuss no muss for retailers. And print the rule book in whatever language it's needed in. Communicate with new immigrant anglers that haven't mastered the language; have them explain the rules to eachother, have them police eachother too, and boom, another problem eliminated.

 

And then tie your fishing license into voter registration. You didn't bother to vote this election? So solly, you don't get to enjoy the rights of a citizen. Boom, another problem eliminated, the deadbeat anglers that trash the waterways and make us all look like scum. Anybody lazy enough to simply drop their garbage on the ground is surely too lazy to ever bother to vote.

 

And ENFORCE POLLUTION LAWS WITH AN IRON FIST. Corporations will be responsible for every meter of ground they pollute, bankruptcy or no bankruptcy. CEO's do time. The biggest offenders laugh at hundred million dollar fines, so hammer them into the ground, take ten years of their profits, or simply SHUT THEM DOWN.

 

And if you think the above is crazy... I'm just getting started.

 

We need to somehow start explaining environmentalism to people. How an angler could ever vote conservative, I'll never know. 99% of high school is entirely worthless, let's stick a full year of environmental studies in there. Maybe that would teach us that everything we do and buy has a consequence. Have the girls trace estrogen through the waterways and treatment plants, and have the boys find out how long a beer can will persist in the wild.

 

Not being concerned about the environment means you like the idea of poisoning your children... what do you think is meant by clean water laws???!

 

But of course, all of the above is but a mad fever-dream.

 

After all, how many guys do you personally know that have a freezer full of fish right now, and are going out for more this weekend?

 

We can't even enforce basic common sense, or simple morality, let alone possession laws, and government will always be more or less idiotic.

 

Such is life.

[ChasinTails]

the worst thing is when i see someone catching salmon thinking theyre gonna gets eggs out of it but find out its not a hen and just leave it !! Like its dead just take it why are you leaving it ?? I wish there were more officers at porthope bowmanville creek at the credit because there more idiots there than anywhere

[NiagaraSteel]

the worst thing is when i see someone catching salmon thinking theyre gonna gets eggs out of it but find out its not a hen and just leave it !! Like its dead just take it why are you leaving it ?? I wish there were more officers at porthope bowmanville creek at the credit because there more idiots there than anywhere

I saw a guy slit a male chinny last year. He asked us if we wanted some roe, and we said no lol. He found nothing in it and tossed it in the water.

P.S. Please stop naming rivers, it's against the forum rules

[Float down]

Should just be C&R for most of south/southwest/GTA.

In a highly populated area like this I find it hard to believe that people NEED to fish to eat. You can go to the store and get 4 large chicken breast on sale for 5$, you can't replace lost fisheries.

I think it's goofy that everyone wants to protect this fishery so much, do to the fact it was intruduced to our great lakes for the means of recteational and comercial fishing. you guys talk about being conservationists, but everyone seems to ignore the fact that the fish we all love are also very distructive to native fish species.
I'm not trying saying I don't love catching salmon and steal more then ANYTHING, because I do, but I think if anything should be protected it should be brookies and lakers, among our other native fish species.

As for the daily limit, as opposed to a yearly one, it would be devastating to a fishery if someone stumbled apon a high density of pre spawn walleye and kept all the big females, wouldn't it? Obviously not the only reason it couldn't work. But people will poach no matter what. A guy in muskoka got busted for shooting not one, but two moose without tags. A lot harder to smuggle a moose then a fish

[Float down]

[quote name="Icehut" post="276774" timestamp="1375932231"]



In fact, go barbless province wide and ELIMINATE THE USE OF ROE right now. Good anglers do not need roe, it leads to mindless slaughter of salmon by steelheaders

Ouch bro, lol. I can imagine you wouldnt be very fun to fish with... I use roe, among other things... I used to think I was a good fisherman. Dang. You're probably right though... Reading water, adjusting depth, and understanding the habits of our fish and a hundred other equations probably don't make people good fisherman. Just whether or not they use spawn or not.