Species #389

[MuskieBait]

Got confirmation from the MNR today that it's permissible to catch alewife and use them dead as bait. Not allowed to net them though and not allowed to transport live or use live.

They have that tantalizing silver flash to them, that I'll bet will work amazing for bait! I caught my first ever real fish on a small dead minnow, and it was a huge pike. So I have a soft spot for small silvery baitfish :lol:

When we were fishing for the Alewife, there were Pike in the evening. There was so much bait around that they did not care to chase any lures. Yes, we did try to fish for them. They all looked to have fat bellies. Why would the Pike chase lures when they can simply cruise along bottom and pick up all the dead Alewife on the bottom?

Now...using an Alewife later in the season when they haven't seen one in months...or fish a large whole dead Alewife in the fall when forage is limited and fish are fattening up... ;-)

 

[MuskieBait]

To me fishing is a hobby, I enjoy my time out doors in nature and enjoy the sights and sounds around me when I get out, does it matter if I catch a fish or how big it is? No, I just spent 5 hours playing with 6 once Bluegills and Perch on Sunday Morning.

To others fishing is a numbers game, they have to catch fish to enjoy it, they over power fish with 30-80lb braid, I mean wheres the fun and challenge in that? There isn't one.

Very few people have or monetary resources to chase the bigger salt water species, so we take what we can get.

To you, it may be just another 'pathetic' Ontario fish, to the person that caught it, its a measure of success on the water that brings them happiness.

Exactly...so a "pathetic" Alewife is a measure of success on the water that brings someone happiness...

Which is my whole point...

I find it much more fun to hunt down species that are less known (or even unknown)...fish that hardly anyone targets...fish that there are little to no information readily available that one can rely upon. Because part of the fun in fishing is to constantly learn...and the learning curve levels off quite a bit after catching bass for 20 years.

So, even if it is a small unassuming species like the Alewife, or Three-spine Stickleback, or Rudd, they provide just as much challenge as it is to hunt down a Steelhead or a Largemouth Bass or a Northern Pike. In fact, I would argue it is easier to hunt down popular game fish due to the sheer amount of information readily available. A non-biting Three-spine Stickleback is just as frustrating as a non-biting Steelhead. A rare Least Darter is just as challenging to find and hook as a Lake Sturgeon.

In the end, it is all about how you approach angling...and whether you have an opened mind or not.

Beauty (and challenge) is in the eye of the beholder. ;-)

Don't judge. ;-)

Again, I guess people can't read sarcasm easily...

 

[usernamehere]

To me fishing is a hobby, I enjoy my time out doors in nature and enjoy the sights and sounds around me when I get out, does it matter if I catch a fish or how big it is? No, I just spent 5 hours playing with 6 once Bluegills and Perch on Sunday Morning.

YUP!

Was out on sunday with my university friend, pump, eric and one other(I know your real name but not your forum name lol) on T-Islands. We didnt get anything, except for eric who got 2 alewives (JDM goodness). It was hot, and we were dead tired walking ALL around the island. I didnt get anything, and had to wade in after a lure. They were having a dragon boat racing and I couldnt fish the spot i normally fish and that sucked. Although I didnt catch anything, I had a good time.

Fishing isnt all about the fish, its about spending time with friends and strangers, relaxing, and having fun. If you get fish, thats just a bonus :mrgreen:

 

[MuskieBait]

Yawn... :roll:

If fishing for Alewife isn't fun and relaxing, and if I don't enjoy the time fishing with friends like Richard and his son Tristan, and our friend Michael...and we met strangers that later became acquaintances on later trips...why the heck would I go back three times just to catch some "pathetic little baitfish" for hours and hours...

Because it is fun and relaxing way to spend time with friends and to meet strangers...

We spent the rest of the evening fishing for Alewife again, Richard, Michael and I. Michael got his lifer Alewife in no time and we kept some Alewife for future salmon bait. It was a fun filled afternoon of quickie fishing.

We've finally and officially came full circle with this discussion and the original purpose of this report...about how fun a "pathetic little baitfish" can be...and not to scoff at some "worthless bait fishing"...it is now a mobius strip...infinity and beyond...

So go and fish for your "wall hanging" Ontario "sportfish" to your hearts contend...brag about your success on forums to reach internet superstardom...and leave all the "worthless" species alone...I know I'll be having just as much fun trying to catch those fish that no one cares about

I know I won't be fishing that FlusterCuck that is this weekend...when half of Ontario's fishing population is out after bass...who wants to deal with crowded boat launches and busy lakes anyways? Gosh, I saw that FlusterCuck on the US side on Saturday...people all fishing for bass on NY side where it is open...counted 30 boats easy...and I said "No thanks." Can't even imagine the stupidity that is the Kawarthas on the weekend. We saw so many boats heading east as we headed west...a boat every 30 seconds...

I had a school of Rudd all to ourselves with no one around. Fun, relaxing and with a good friend...don't need a passport or a NY license...or deal with other boaters on crowded Kawartha lakes...and yeah, we were catching too.

When we were catching Alewife on every drop, we were the only little dinghy in the marina fishing, plus two "locals" at their slips. No one around, constant bendo on ultralight rods...even the ocassional drag singing...fun, relaxing and with friends. Go fight for a spot on a steelhead stream or on a bass lake.

 

[Knuguy]

Geez---I'm not sure if I just stirred up a hornets' nest or started a philosophical discussion on the 'zen of fishing'. All I did was razz MB and ST a bit about their catches. It's been kinda slow on here, y'know!! To each his own I guess. Live and let live. <Insert appropriate cliche here>. :lol:

 

[salmotrutta]

When we were fishing for the Alewife, there were Pike in the evening. There was so much bait around that they did not care to chase any lures. Yes, we did try to fish for them. They all looked to have fat bellies. Why would the Pike chase lures when they can simply cruise along bottom and pick up all the dead Alewife on the bottom?

Now...using an Alewife later in the season when they haven't seen one in months...or fish a large whole dead Alewife in the fall when forage is limited and fish are fattening up... ;-)

Hmm..my alewife spot is an excellent spot for pike. 3 pike in an hour of fishing is normal, and 5-10 pike is common in an evening. Lots of factors will effect whether a pike will be interested in your lure or not, as I'm sure someone with your breadth of experience knows.

But my plan is not to use alewives in the spot where I can catch them, it's to take them to fish other lakes and rivers. They have the right colour, size and shape that game fish find irresistible - so I'm pretty excited to give them a shot. I had a productive weekend for bass and pike using spoons and a jointed rapala, but if I had brought some alewives with me, there were times when I would have loved to have used them. I have yet to see what kind of action they produce, but if a dead baitfish is hooked and presented properly, it can work even better than a live one.

Kawarthas were not that bad this weekend. I did not experience crowded lakes or launches - maybe I just picked the right spots.


Bet you weren't expecting being a little tongue in cheek would set off such a strong reaction!

 

[OCDComputing]

This has been an interesting thread for sure...apparently *sarcasm* and *tongue in cheek* get missed from time to time. I do actually agree with with MB on a lot of points. "Game" fish are generally well known and the fishing "style" is pretty well known for most of them. Generally...there are a time and a place for most of the game fish that a lot of us target...and yes...myself included..lol!

That being said, I've always enjoyed any fish that I have managed to land. I have caught a few that I have had NO idea what the heck they were. Would I go back and try and target them again?...Absolutely! And yes, some have been just a few inches long (when I was first playing with the fly rod).

Why do we fish? Well...I suspect everyone could come up with a different reason why he/she does/doesn't do what they do!

For me, I find it very therapeutic...I love being on the water and it doesn't matter what the water is (River/Lake/Ocean/Stream/Pond/Res/Etc)...each of these types of water bodies hold their share of challenges....are you shore fishing/wading/kayak/boat...they ALL open up different opportunities and challenges.

Why do you think there are different sections in this forum...it is to help those of us that tend to focus on the different types of fishing (fly/float/spinning/etc)...it is what brings us all together and also keeps us a *bit* different/unique! There is nothing wrong with the different types of fishing...it is all personal preference. For me...I am really liking all the different types of fishing that I do (it's all based on my mood)...I enjoy Float/Spinning/Bait Casting/Fly...who is to say what is right?...ME! Nobody else can say what is right for me except me.

I'm sorry if this seems a bit like a soap-box rant...but holy crap...we all target/fish for different (personal preference) reasons. We ALL love to target different species for personal reasons...why the heck would you want to "chirp" on someone that has caught fish that most of us (OK...I will admit TOTAL jealousy!!!! Dang dude...I'd be lucky if I could list 25 fish that I have caught!!)...only dream about...is totally beyond me!

MuskieBait.....In "MY" personal opinion....keep those reports coming...I get to live vicariously through you! Love the reports and the pictures...and wish I could say the same!

Tight Lines All!! And I do hope, that if you do catch something new/different/unique to you...that you post it up! Because I for one...love to read the reports and see the pictures!

LOL...the only "interesting to me" fish that I have caught for a first time was a Gobie...ugly little bastich...reported it to the MNR and they called back and posted the location since it had not been reported in that area before.

Cheers all!
Cameron

 

[MuskieBait]

Hmm..my alewife spot is an excellent spot for pike. 3 pike in an hour of fishing is normal, and 5-10 pike is common in an evening. Lots of factors will effect whether a pike will be interested in your lure or not, as I'm sure someone with your breadth of experience knows.

But my plan is not to use alewives in the spot where I can catch them, it's to take them to fish other lakes and rivers. They have the right colour, size and shape that game fish find irresistible - so I'm pretty excited to give them a shot. I had a productive weekend for bass and pike using spoons and a jointed rapala, but if I had brought some alewives with me, there were times when I would have loved to have used them. I have yet to see what kind of action they produce, but if a dead baitfish is hooked and presented properly, it can work even better than a live one.

Kawarthas were not that bad this weekend. I did not experience crowded lakes or launches - maybe I just picked the right spots.


Bet you weren't expecting being a little tongue in cheek would set off such a strong reaction!

Yeah, there are certainly various factors affecting the mood of Pike. We tried all three times with same results. Granted, we didn't fish any other time of day except for late afternoon/evening just before dark...and we were too busy with the Alewife so we only make a few cast for Pike when we see them...so sampling is small and metric is poor.

Richard did say that in his experience, fishing at the marina is rather poor until later in the summer. Come late summer, the fishing heats up...and in late fall up to just before ice up, the fishing for the big pike is really good.

I just started fishing his marina last year...so again...takes time to learn about a particular location, the timing, the technique...etc...etc...etc. Until you pattern it...

Also difficult to get pike to bite when you're fishing over a whole school of Alewife over hundreds of baitfish strong...even when you differentiate your lure from the bait by using striking and contrasting colours...and matching the hatch with a dead Alewife got ignored too.

Anyways...

This place is like a ticking time bomb waiting to blow...can't even have a bit of fun with tongue and cheek...what's with that? People talk about relaxing...but everyone is so S.E.R.I.O.U.S...seriously...

I'm not even that old...but I feel old and grumpy here. :roll:

 

[OCDComputing]

Yeah, there are certainly various factors affecting the mood of Pike. We tried all three times with same results. Granted, we didn't fish any other time of day except for late afternoon/evening just before dark...and we were too busy with the Alewife so we only make a few cast for Pike when we see them...so sampling is small and metric is poor.

Richard did say that in his experience, fishing at the marina is rather poor until later in the summer. Come late summer, the fishing heats up...and in late fall up to just before ice up, the fishing for the big pike is really good.

I just started fishing his marina last year...so again...takes time to learn about a particular location, the timing, the technique...etc...etc...etc. Until you pattern it...

Also difficult to get pike to bite when you're fishing over a whole school of Alewife over hundreds of baitfish strong...even when you differentiate your lure from the bait by using striking and contrasting colours...and matching the hatch with a dead Alewife got ignored too.

Anyways...

This place is like a ticking time bomb waiting to blow...can't even have a bit of fun with tongue and cheek...what's with that? People talk about relaxing...but everyone is so S.E.R.I.O.U.S...seriously...

I'm not even that old...but I feel old and grumpy here. :roll:

LOL!! I'm probably twice your age...but you know what..the secret to a stress free life...is not to worry about what other people think! You have posted some great reports and some awesome pictures! Don't get grumpy...just enjoy doing what makes you happy! I can tell you that seeing the pictures and reading your reports (other than making me totally jealous!)...makes me happy!

Tight lines!

 

[salmotrutta]

I think one of the coolest catches would be a wild tiger trout from a local stream.

Blue walleye would be fun too, but not sure how to positively identify a blue walleye from a normal walleye that looks blueish.

Aurora trout would also be nice.

 

[MuskieBait]

LOL!! I'm probably twice your age...but you know what..the secret to a stress free life...is not to worry about what other people think! You have posted some great reports and some awesome pictures! Don't get grumpy...just enjoy doing what makes you happy! I can tell you that seeing the pictures and reading your reports (other than making me totally jealous!)...makes me happy!

Tight lines!

LOL. Nah, I don't stress over what's been said at all. All I want to do is to show fishing for non-conventional species in a better light...and challenge those with their beliefs.

If I really do care how others view me, I probably won't do what I do and fish what I fish...because apparently, only gamefish are "cool".

There's more to come...I'll never stop hunting species as long as I can fish...although, there are times I do enjoy some gamefish when my targets and the hunt for them are stressing me out LOL.

 

[MuskieBait]

I think one of the coolest catches would be a wild tiger trout from a local stream.

Blue walleye would be fun too, but not sure how to positively identify a blue walleye from a normal walleye that looks blueish.

Aurora trout would also be nice.

I wouldn't like to catch a wild Tiger Trout...it means that Brook Trout and Brown Trout are sharing beds...and it'll harm the native Brook Trout. Of course, this event is very, very, very rare.

As far as studies show, true Blue Walleye (or Blue Pike if you ask the Americans) are no more...extinct. It was a unique subspecies (Sander vitreus glaucus) of Walleye that was unique to Lake Erie. What's left now are normal walleye with blue pigments...which you may encounter in Northern Ontario or in Quebec...apparently quite frequently in some Quebec lakes.

Aurora Trout (Salvelinus fontinalis timagamiensis) is a subspecies of Brook Trout, kind of like Volcano Creek Golden Trout is a subspecies of Rainbow Trout. They are cool indeed.

 

[[email protected]]

Aurora Trout spots are tightly regulated, as in 1 catch and done, C&R or take it home, doesn't matter. Atlantic Salmon regs are the same in the Gaspe Bay, 2 and done

 

[cptpronin]

And we have a new "Sarcastaball" chapion.... Muskiebait!

Muskiebait, I appreciate the tongue-in-cheek humour, but feel bad for those who let sail over their head. Their loss. lol.

 

[MuskieBait]

http://youtu.be/wCy8MpT45gk

 

[Knuguy]

so have you caught any sculpins yet? I remember as a kid trying to avoid catching those!! :razz:

 

[MuskieBait]

Which scuplin are you talking about? ;-) Which species did you catch and from where did you catch them?

I've caught Pacific Staghorn Sculpin, Prickly Sculpin and Woolly Sculpin from the Pacific...as well as the California Scorpinfish that locals often call "sculpins". I haven't caught any sculpin species from the Atlantic though...and none from Ontario so far.

But...finding and catching Mottled Sculpin and/or Slimy Sculpin is on my to-do list for this summer. Probably in August when water is at its lowest and I can search riffles more effectively.

Next year, I may take a trip to the Atlantic provinces where I can catch Shorthorn Sculpins. My friend Eli, who just returned from that area a couple of weeks ago, said they are pretty numerous and commmon.

A couple of years ago, I had planned a trip to Nunavut where I could catch Fourhorn Sculpin...but being invited to a buddy's wedding I had to cancel my trip. Instead I went to California after the wedding and caught the Woolly Sculpin that I mentioned above.

 

[Knuguy]

I think it must have been shorthorn. Not much challenge. We used to pull our bait away before they could grab it. They are mostly mouth.

http://canlit.ca/reviews/sage_and_silly


Al Pittman’s book of rhymes for children Down by Jim Long’s Stage first appeared in 1976, when it was widely and deservedly admired. Its characters are fish and shellfish: “A sculpin named Sam / thought as he swam / how wonderful ugly / was he. / He said with a grin, / ‘I’m as ugly as sin.’ / ‘I’m the ugliest fish in the sea.’”

 

[MuskieBait]

Poor Shorthorns...even in a children's book they don't get too much respect.

I find them very cool. Prickly and a bit mean looking. But if they are anything like the Pacific Staghorn Sculpin, they are not mean at all...just a little eager scavenger/predator.

Never fished the Atlantic coast Canada...so looking forward to this trip if it materializes! I have some easy targets to check off like the Shorthorn Sculpin, Atlantic Tomcod, Winter Flounder, and Threespined Stickleback. I think my timing of mid or late June may be a bit early for Atlantic Mackerel and Pollock to come inshore...but it would be cool to catch those too.

Any other fish you think I may encounter? Sounds like you did a lot of fishing "back home".

Eventually, I want to catch a new species from every Canadian provinces and territories. I've caught new species from Ontario, British Columbia and Quebec already...missed out on Alberta when we couldn't find Goldeye...but one day I'll go back for Goldeye.

As for the rest...

Yukon - Broad Whitefish or Pygmy Whitefish
Northwest Territories - Inconnu...know a friend...got a very good lead...
Nunavut - Arctic Char, Greenland Cod, Saffron Cod, Fourhorn Sculpin
Alberta - Goldeye
Saskatchwan - Plains Minnow?
Manitoba - some kind of micro species I've yet to catch...
New Brunswick - Atlantic Tomcod
Prince Edward Island - Winter Flounder
Nova Scotia - Pollock
Newfoundland / Labrador - Shorthorn Sculpin

That would be entirely AWESOME!!!

 

[Knuguy]

Poor Shorthorns...even in a children's book they don't get too much respect.

I find them very cool. Prickly and a bit mean looking. But if they are anything like the Pacific Staghorn Sculpin, they are not mean at all...just a little eager scavenger/predator.

Never fished the Atlantic coast Canada...so looking forward to this trip if it materializes! I have some easy targets to check off like the Shorthorn Sculpin, Atlantic Tomcod, Winter Flounder, and Threespined Stickleback. I think my timing of mid or late June may be a bit early for Atlantic Mackerel and Pollock to come inshore...but it would be cool to catch those too.

Any other fish you think I may encounter? Sounds like you did a lot of fishing "back home".

Eventually, I want to catch a new species from every Canadian provinces and territories. I've caught new species from Ontario, British Columbia and Quebec already...missed out on Alberta when we couldn't find Goldeye...but one day I'll go back for Goldeye.

As for the rest...

Yukon - Broad Whitefish or Pygmy Whitefish
Northwest Territories - Inconnu
Nunavut - Arctic Char, Greenland Cod, Saffron Cod, Fourhorn Sculpin
Alberta - Goldeye
Saskatchwan - Plains Minnow?
Manitoba - some kind of micro species I've yet to catch...
New Brunswick - Atlantic Tomcod
Prince Edward Island - Winter Flounder
Nova Scotia - Pollock
Newfoundland / Labrador - Shorthorn Sculpin

That would be entirely AWESOME!!!

Go for broke---try to get a bluefin tuna---several 100 #(or kg, take your pick.

It was sometimes winter flounder we were trying to catch and sculpins would not let us get our bait down. Flounders have been known to be caught on a piece of bright red paper from a Target tobacco pkg, but that's probably a bit hard to find these day!!(Ah, the memories). :lol: