Talking about line strength as #6, #10 etc....

[MichaelVerdirame]

What does that mean? Is #6 line just 6lb line? :S

 

[Blair]

EXCELLENT QUESTION!


In today's GLOBAL MARKET, many terms & ratings can be CONFUSING.
Here in North America it can get even more frustrating considering we use BOTH the Imperial and Metric System - Sometimes at the same time!



In answer to your question:

The PE standard of measurement is based on a numbering system known as “gouw”, the system that the Japanese originally used to measure the diameter of silk thread. This measurement system has since been applied to monofilament and braided fishing lines. The “PE” stands for Polyethylene, the fibre used to make Dyneema and Spectra braided lines.The PE rating is a constant measurement, so while two lines advertised as being rated to 50lb may actually test at different breaking strains, two lines with the same PE rating will always be the same diameter. As a very general rule, you can multiply the PE# by 10 to get an approximate breaking strain of a braided line, i.e. PE4 x 10 = 40lb, as it will rarely test below (10xPE#). However, the breaking strain can vary a great deal between different lines of the same diameter. This is especially true in many of the high end braids that use more strands and a tighter weave, resulting in a rounder, smoother finish and higher breaking strain for the same diameter as lines of lesser quality. For instance, YGK Galis Ultra Jig Man X8 in PE5 is rated to 86lb, but Sunline Super PE PE5 is rated to 50lb. Higher end lines are often specialised for either casting or vertical jigging, and usually carry a higher price tag to match their superior finish and higher breaking strain/diameter ratio.


PE Rating – Fishing Line Diameter Chart

Below is a guide that lists the diameter (in millimetres) of each PE rating.

PE # Diameter

PE 0.6 ………………………….. 0.128mm
PE 0.8 ………………………….. 0.148mm
PE 1 …………………………….. 0.165mm
PE 1.2 ………………………….. 0.185mm
PE 1.5 ………………………….. 0.205mm
PE 1.7 ………………………….. 0.218mm
PE 2 …………………………….. 0.235mm
PE 2.5 ………………………….. 0.260mm
PE 3 …………………………….. 0.285mm
PE 3.5 ………………………….. 0.310mm
PE 4 …………………………….. 0.330mm
PE 5 …………………………….. 0.370mm
PE 6 …………………………….. 0.405mm
PE 7 …………………………….. 0.435mm
PE 8 …………………………….. 0.470mm
PE 10 …………………………… 0.520mm
PE 12 …………………………… 0.570mm
PE 14 …………………………… 0.620mm
PE 16 …………………………… 0.660mm
PE 18 …………………………… 0.700mm
PE 20 …………………………… 0.740mm
PE 22 …………………………… 0.780mm
PE 24 …………………………… 0.810mm
PE 28 …………………………… 0.870mm



For the "most part" I would assume you are looking into fishing line for Spin reel, Bait Caster etc. (NOT FLY FISHING LINE) if that is the case, here is an example you would see on the Internet:

- Color: Brown
- Material: Resin
- Wire diameter: 0.40mm
- Wire length: 500 meters
- Max. load: 15.6Kg
- Perfect thread for any fishing lover


Item: 0.40mm 500M Resin Fishing Line / Thread - Brown (#6)
Dimensions: 0.00 in x 0.00 in x 0.00 in (0.00 cm x 0.00 cm x 0.00 cm)
Weight: 5.61 oz (159 g)


_______________________________________________________




To make it EVEN more CONFUSING .... Fly Fishermen also have a "System that uses #":





The fly fishing line that you purchase will be rated according to weight, one being the lightest. The higher the number, the heavier the line.

Many fly fishing anglers use fly fishing line that is rated between 4 and 6. These lines are used on fly fishing rods that are rated for a particular weight of line.

At the same time, certain weights of line are used for catching particular fish species. Here are some examples:

• Fly fishing line weight of 1 to 3 is used for small trout and panfish.
• 4 to 5 weight fly line is best for freshwater bass, and trout.
• 6 and 7 weight line is good for bass, bonefish, pike, stripers, and trout.
• 8 and 9 weight fly fishing line is used for bluefish, bonefish, salmon of all species, and stripers.
• 10 to 12 weight line is for tarpon, swordfish, and other large game fish.

​

These are only suggestions and can be used as a guide when deciding which line weight you should use.

Graphite rods allow for some leeway in the weight of fly fishing line.If you’d rather, you can move up or down a weight of line from these recommendations.

Many rods will have a rating that covers more than one weight eg. #6/8. This indicates that the rod can cast a #6, #7 or #8 line. In this instance it is likely that the rod would be best with a #7 line in the hands of an experienced caster.




​

 

[Dugger]

.... ummmm what?!?!? :blink:

 

[Blair]

.... ummmm what?!?!? :blink:

*SMILES* ... I said: "It can be confusing" ....


Not really though, just different ways of measuring and stating the parameters.
Fortunately, most of us stick with what we know or get recommendations from Friends and Co-Fishermen.


The "ratings" for hooks can even be confusing as well.

Example: We normally (here in Canada) will consider the LOWER NUMBER as a bigger hook. So, say for Trout fishing a good size is like: #6, -#8, #10 (Some guys go micro #14, #18 ... i have even seen hooks as small as #24). I typically use a #2 or #4 for Bass.

I ordered some hooks from a reputable dealer in the US. Thought I would be getting #6 hooks for my trout ... NOPE: they sent me #6 but there system! It turned out the Hooks were HUGE. I use them now for Hooking a Large Minnow for Pike etc.


UPDATE:


Hook Sizes
The numbers that define hook sizes can be confusing, but the system is really very simple. Hook sizes are based on a nominal hook size of zero. Hook sizes with a number followed by a zero increase in size as the number goes up.

For instance a 4/0, ("four bar oh" or "four oh"), hook is one size up from a 3/0, which is one size up from a 2/0, etc.

Hook sizes not followed by a zero, decreasein size as the number increases.

For example a size 3 hook is smaller than a size 2 hook, which is smaller than a size 1 hook.

While nearly all hook manufacturers follow this basic numbering system to indicate the increase or decrease in size of each hook within an individual pattern, there is unfortunately little standardisation in overall sizes. For instance what may be a size 4/0 in a Mustad hook may not necessarily be the same as a 4/0 in a Gamakatsu hook.





* Stick with the system you know, and when in doubt - either research the "conversion" or STAY AWAY! (unless you can TOUCH/ SEE/ COMPARE IT in person)

 

[grubman]

I don't recall ever seeing a PE# but once I see the lb rating that's it. I'll look for it next time I'm at LeBarons. Thanks for the great info on lines.

 

[Blair]

Covering the Basics: Understanding Fishing Line Characteristics

Whether you are preparing to fish in a lake, river, or ocean, considering the unique personalities of your line will have you on the fast track to success and making the big catch of the day. Below are the main components of fishing line:

Diameter: This determines the line's test strength which features improved line durability. DICK'S premium lines offer thinner diameters for increased strength and stability, while also providing you with a more sensitive line to help you feel the fish nibbling on your bait or lure.

Abrasion resistance: When fishing lines are subjected to harsh conditions such as rocks, tree stumps and extreme weather conditions, they need to be abrasion-resistant. We provide line that withstands scuffing, nicks and the normal wear-and-tear from repeated casting.

Color: When looking for the perfect line color, consider finding one that is visible to you, while being nearly invisible to a fish. Below are the different color types that DICK'S offers:

• Low-visibility: A stealth-like line that blends into most underwater environments when the fish aren't biting or heavy fishing in the area has made the fish smarter.
• Low-visibility clear: This color works well in ultra-clear water or when you know the fishing area you have selected tends to have fish that seem reluctant to bite.
• Clear/blue fluorescent: A perfect balance for sunlight to illuminate the line above the surface, while staying clear below the surface.
• High-visibility gold: This bright color makes it easier to see when a fish strikes and to view your line position in a current. This color is also beneficial for low-light conditions including dawn, dusk, and at night.
• Moss green: This color works well in waters with heavy vegetation or algae.

Stiffness or Limpness

When looking for your ideal fishing line, it's important to consider the type of reel you will be using and the size of fish you are looking to catch. Stiffer fishing line is stronger and works best with catching bigger fish, while limper line works well with catching small fish. A stiffer line works better on bait casting reels, while spin cast reels are most appropriate for a thin, limp line.

Fishing Line Materials: Find Your Best Line

Being prepared on the water with the proper line will make the fishing experience an enjoyable one. Selecting the perfect line is a science and requires an understanding of the kind of fishermen you are or would like to become. You have to consider the type of fish you're trying to catch and the environment you're fishing in. Here are the different types of line available:


Monofilament/Copolymer: The most popular fishing line materials made from nylon, which floats which is important when using lures that work best when close to the surface. Monofilament line is also flexible, which can help prevent a break if the line comes under sudden stress. Copolymer line adds more resistance, while still providing sensitivity and stretch using an inner and outer sheath of nylon to improve the line's ability to withstand wear-and-tear.


Braided:Braided fishing line has small diameter lines improve strength and maintain durability. The nylon is woven in a braided line to add strength while still keeping the line thin. At DICK'S, our braided lines provide an additional coating to hold the braid together, increasing its durability and strength. Braided lines are strong and abrasion-resistant to work well if you will be fishing in cluttered waters.


Fusion: Micro-fiber nylon is fused together to maintain sensitivity, strength and a small line diameter, while keeping the line limp for easier casting and distance. The improved sensitivity and strength make it the best fishing line when baitcasting for bigger fish such as muskie or northern pike. You can also cast the fusion lines easily with the sensitivity and limited stretch allowing you to successfully set the hook when you have a fish biting the bait.


Fluorocarbon: The latest advance in fishing line and one of the best fishing lines is fluorocarbon line made from a polymer of fluorine boned to carbon. Fluorocarbon line comes closest to the refractive index of water, so it becomes virtually invisible under water, but is visible above the surface. This makes for a strong, clear and dense line material. Fluorocarbon lines also sink, making them an option for bottom-running bait.

• Invisibility: This is a very important benefit, especially in clear water or finesse fishing.
• Durability: The sun's ultraviolet rays don't affect the line allowing for an increased shelf-life.
• Strength: Fluorocarbon line doesn't absorb water so it keeps its strength.
• Stiffness: This line also has low stretch to help with sensitivity in hooking fish. Its stiffness also means the line doesn't float, so it allows lures to go down deeper and jigs to fall faster.

Pound-Test for Fishing Lines

Fishing line is classified by the "pound-test," the measurement relating to the amount of force, in pounds, required to break the line. The pound-test of the line you use is determined more by the amount of drag pressure you apply than it is by the size of the fish you might catch. In some cases, line can stretch and provide additional durability that exceeds the pound test listed. Below are a few examples:

• Monofilament/Copolymer: Look for line with the lowest diameter-to-pound test ratio for the best performance. Monofilament will break down when exposed to direct sunlight and should be changed every six months to a year depending on how often it is used.
• Braided: Braided lines are stronger per diameter than monofilament; you can often get 60 pounds of breaking strength in braided line that has the same diameter as 30-pound test monofilament.
• Novice anglers: Should choose the line that meets the size of the fish they want to catch. Choose a heavier line if you are unsure.
• Advanced anglers: Should choose to use the lightest line possible to increase the challenge of landing a fish.

 

[Blair]

I don't recall ever seeing a PE# but once I see the lb rating that's it. I'll look for it next time I'm at LeBarons. Thanks for the great info on lines.

GREAT ARTICLE:
Line Technology 『The Difference in Line Strength Is a Matter of Weight』

â– The Deceptiveness of Line Labelings


What do you look for most when choosing a fishing line? While there are a wide range of choices available to suit the type of fishing and individual preferences, a slender, yet strong line is all in all the best choice for any situation. If the question of material strength is left aside, it goes without saying that a thinner line is more advantageous for fishing. Amongst the teeming competition of today's field, superiority of line quality can have a big effect on your catch. For the Japanese, with their penchant for sensitivity in fishing, insistence on "thinness" is a must.
However, here lies a major pitfall. Does all line with a thickness index of 1 have the same diameter, regardless of the product? Are they the same even when made from different materials? Bringing in a big fish on thin line is the angler's badge of honor, but can the thickness index really help you make the best choice? Is your line providing you with a catch you can be proud of?

â– Different Diameters for the Same Thickness Index?


There are prescribed "standard diameters" for nylon line. For example, 0.165mm for thickness Index 1 -- no more, no less. However, slight fluctuations and a certain margin of error inevitably occur in the production process, so if a line is thinner than the standard diameter of the next thickness index number up, it can be be labeled as Index 1. This gives for a situation where "precisely Index 1" and "Index 1 verging on Index 1.5" are labeled together on the market. Moreover, for thinner lines requiring advanced manufacturing technology, the diameter becomes more and more difficult to control.


Yet even though a minimal standard exists for nylon lines, things become even more confusing when we consider the labelings for fluorocarbon and polyethylene (Dyneema) lines, which merely "borrow" the nylon standard diameters. Especially in the case of polyethylene (PE) line, the market is flooded with obviously thick products, but when you considers the higher costs involved with thinner raw line, the possibility of customers being deceived by thicker raw line used to keep costs down and improve strength (tensile strength: measured by cutting a portion of line at random and pulling on both ends) can not be ruled out. This is why a simple comparison of strength between two lines can not be made even though they may be labeled with the same thickness index.

●A Word on Pound Notation


Recently line labeled with pound (lb) notation is becoming more and more common. The pounds in this case indicate linear strength. This method of notation is based on neither thickness nor weight, and hence cannot be converted into a thickness index number. In order for even a rough conversion to be possible, the "weight" of the line must also be known.
Furthermore, for 12lb line we can calculate the linear strength to be 5.436kg (1lb = 0.453kg,) but one needs to be careful as this means that the line "must break" at 5.436kg. If the line has a linear strength less than 5.436kg, then there is no problem labeling it as 12lb; but for example, if the line has a linear strength of 6kg then it must be labeled as 13.3lb. In general, the actual linear strength has to be less than the pound notation. The reasoning for this has its roots in big-game fishing, which aims to "bring in the biggest fish possible on the weakest line."


As for methods of labeling fishing line world-wide, the United States uses pound notation. Europe uses a combined notation of line diameter (mm) and linear strength (kg.) In Japan, Korea and Taiwan, the thickness index used to indicate line diameter is most common, but the use of pound notation is on the rise. As just mentioned, pound notation implies that the line will break at a lower value than the labeling, but in the case of kilogram notation, the labeling represents an average value of linear strength. Many American products using pound notation are actually stronger than their labelings indicate, with one extreme example being line with linear strength of 16lb being sold as 8lb line. There are also European products which are actually stronger or thinner than their labelings indicate. Also, amongst Japan, Korea and Taiwan, only Japan has prescribed standard diameters for the thickness index for nylon line, while no standards exist for fluorocarbon and PE lines, making for an unreliable labeling situation. Currently, attempts are underway to improve the situation, such as the European Fishing Tackle Trade Association which is defining standards and awarding certification to products meeting the new specifications.

â– The Key to Making High-precision Line


In old Japan, the measurement of line thickness was made in terms of the traditional Japanese shakkan-ho^ units of weight: "fun," "rin," and "mo^." In 1959, these units served as the basis for the establishment of standard line diameters and the thickness index, but nowadays the notion of weight seems to have almost entirely escaped from memory. However, this forgotten notion of line weight is the key in our pursuit of high-precision line manufacturing.
Currently, the decitex (dtex) is the unit of measure for line weight. (However, the former denier unit is still often found in use. 1 denier equals 1g per 9000m.) Weight of 1g per length 10,000m of line is defined as 1dtex, and thickness Index 1 nylon line has a value of 245dtex -- or for 100m of Index 1 line, a weight of 2.45g. If the length and weight are known, the the line's average diameter can naturally also be calculated, but as an example, if the line's weight is greater than 2.45g, then we know that it is thicker than the standard diameter. Also, the denier value becomes necessary to calculate a line's "tensile strength." When the line's linear strength value is divided by the denier value, we obtain a value representing the line's true material strength, regardless of thickness.

â– Comparison of Strength per Uniform Cross-sectional Area
(Standard Diameter ?0.165mm for Nylon Index 1)


The function of line in fishing is obvious: to serve as a direct link to pull in the fish. In light of this function, a stronger line can be made thinner, so in choosing a line, strength becomes the first point of consideration. But what should one look for when trying to choose the strongest line? Line developed from materials such as fluorocarbon, nylon and Dyneema with a wide range of characteristics are available in tackle shops. For example, nylon is popular as an easy-to-use all-around line; fluorocarbon is popular as a leader; and Dyneema is a common choice for the main line. However, given the vague relationship between line diameter and index numbers under the current labelings, index numbers are not enough to make for a uniform comparison of line strength. If there is a margin of error between index notations -- in other words, a margin of error in thickness -- some other standard for line strength becomes necessary in order to make a good decision.


Let us then examine a comparison of line strength per cross-sectional area for each material. If we derive the line strengths for samples with uniform cross-sectional area, then we can compare the true strength of each line regardless of thickness or index number. Comparison of strength with uniform cross-sectional area is the key to understanding the strength inherent to each product.
In order to obtain the cross-sectional area, we will use the decitex and denier values mentioned earlier. The cross-sectional area can be derived by the formula {π × radius × radius}. (π ? 3.14) The line's diameter can be calculated from its precise weight and the specific gravity of the material, namely: {√(denier value ÷ (specific gravity × 9000m × π)) × 2} or {√(decitex value ÷ (specific gravity × 10000m × π)) × 2}. Taking Index 1 line as an example, nylon line has a specific gravity of 1.14; fluorocarbon has a specific gravity of 1.78. Furthermore, nylon has a denier value of 219, or 243dtex, while fluorocarbon has a denier value of 342, or 380dtex. If we take Index 1 line at its standard diameter of 0.165mm, using the above formula we derive a cross-sectional area of 0.0213716mm2. Actual measurements of our products show nylon with a denier value of 219 and strength of 2.2kg, fluorocarbon with a denier value of 342 and strength of 2.052kg. Using the formula {kg × f ÷ mm2} for strength per square-millimeter, we obtain 102.9kg/mm2 for nylon and 96kg/mm2 for fluorocarbon. Since these figures represent strength in terms of square-millimeters, it becomes evident that nylon is essentially the stronger material. For reference, performing the calculations in deniers gives 10.04g/denier for nylon and 6.00g/denier for fluorocarbon. Actual fishing conditions like immersion in water and exposure to sunlight are also a factor, so choosing a fishing line of course isn't all math. But knowing the strengths of the materials you use can bring a new sense of enjoyment to your fishing.

 

[Meanderer]

It would be both helpful and proper if when someone chooses to reproduce another's work the source of that work be identified. A web link could also qualify.

 

[FishingNoob]

Thanks for all the information Blair! You sure do have a library of fishing info and facts! You could have your own section, Blair's Helpful and Informative Fishing Facts, Tips and Essays! Cheers.

 

[Blair]

It would be both helpful and proper if when someone chooses to reproduce another's work the source of that work be identified. A web link could also qualify.

absolutely! my bad - guess i was getting a little lazy before heading out.

ps: Most of the articles have the links encoded right in them.


For the one's I missed, here's the LINK:



http://www.google.ca/



*SMILES*

 

[sunny14]

absolutely! my bad - guess i was getting a little lazy before heading out.

ps: Most of the articles have the links encoded right in them.


For the one's I missed, here's the LINK:



http://www.google.ca/



*SMILES*

Blair: Sorry Buddy but the LINK goes to a Blank Google Page, waiting to be filled in.


Rick

 

[NADO]

For the one's I missed, here's the LINK:


http://www.google.ca/


*SMILES*

lol Nice, were not in school anymore...no need to call anyone out on plagiarism, especially when they aren’t trying to pass it off as their own.

I personally cant read those articles though, wayyyy too long for what I come to this forum for.

 

[Blair]

lol Nice, were not in school anymore...no need to call anyone out on plagiarism, especially when they aren’t trying to pass it off as their own.

I personally cant read those articles though, wayyyy too long for what I come to this forum for.

Some of them are .... lol
The tech spects, can get rather boring .... but their there.

My "personal feeling" on most tackle is this: (Previously stated at the end of one article)

* Stick with the system you know, and when in doubt - either research the "conversion" or STAY AWAY! (unless you can TOUCH/ SEE/ COMPARE IT in person)